On Apr 28, 2010, at 11:26 AM, Paul Tykodi wrote:
> Hi Ira,
>> I wanted to add my voice, as the current IPP Working Group Chair, to say
> that I fully support the decision to not require printing with generic
> (PDL-based) printer drivers as a conformance requirement for IPP Everywhere.
FWIW, I'm certainly hoping that we *do* end up with at least one common, required PDL, otherwise IPP Everywhere will be as useless as IPP/2.0 - we don't need another raw transport pipe... And if you'll remember I argued for a required PDL when we defined IPP/2.0 as well (for the same reasons...)
> I do believe the printing experience would be greatly enhanced by reducing
> the need for printer drivers but I don't think adding this as a requirement
> to IPP Everywhere would enhance the proposed specification's acceptance by
> the industry at this moment in time.
Given that a common PDL is pretty much the only way to get away from printer drivers (which opens up LOTS of new markets, particularly in the mobile space), I think we do really need to make it a requirement.
> Do you think we should develop a short FAQ on some of the potential IPP
> Everywhere use case scenarios we have already started collecting for other
> reasons within PWG (i.e. Cloud Printing) to help give people further context
> on the plans for IPP Everywhere prior to the actual vote?
I think a FAQ (along with updates to my slides) is entirely appropriate.
>> Let me know your thoughts.
>> Thanks.
>> Best Regards,
>> /Paul
> --
> Paul Tykodi
> Principal Consultant
> TCS - Tykodi Consulting Services LLC
>> Tel/Fax: 603-343-1820
> Mobile: 603-866-0712
> E-mail: ptykodi at tykodi.com> WWW: http://www.tykodi.com>>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: ipp-bounces at pwg.org [mailto:ipp-bounces at pwg.org] On Behalf Of Ira
>> McDonald
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2010 1:40 PM
>> To: Michael Sweet; Ira McDonald
>> Cc: ipp at pwg.org; George Liu
>> Subject: Re: [IPP] Stable draft of IPP Everywhere Project Charter (17
>> April2010)
>>>> Hi George,
>>>> Thanks for your good feedback.
>>>> Apparently, we're going to have to bend the PWG Process
>> a bit - e.g., to allow a Yes vote with editorial comments.
>>>> The PWG does NOT normally *vote* on individual project
>> charters - only on entire new working group charters.
>>>> But Bill Wagner suggested in the PWG Steering Committee
>> that we make this exception in order to get wider visibility for
>> the IPP Everywhere project.
>>>> Note that IPP/2.0 is simply IPP/1.1 with *correct* handling
>> of errors and exceptions (as already specified in IPP/1.1),
>> so I think it's a reasonable basis for IPP Everywhere.
>>>> Also, although IPP Everywhere supports the goal of printing
>> with generic (PDL-based) printer drivers, it's NOT an actual
>> requirement - I'm not sure about adding this to the charter,
>> rather than the *future* IPP Everywhere Requirements spec.
>>>> Mike - remember that "Yes with comments" should be allowed
>> in your posted PWG Formal Vote announcement.
>>>> Cheers,
>> - Ira
>>>>>> Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
>> Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
>> Co-Chair - TCG Hardcopy WG
>> IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
>> Blue Roof Music/High North Inc
>>http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic>>http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc>> mailto:blueroofmusic at gmail.com>> winter:
>> 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176
>> 734-944-0094
>> summer:
>> PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839
>> 906-494-2434
>>>>>>>> On Tue, Apr 27, 2010 at 8:39 PM, Michael Sweet <msweet at apple.com> wrote:
>>> On Apr 27, 2010, at 5:22 PM, George Liu wrote:
>>>> Michael,
>>>>>>>> Thanks for the quick feedback.
>>>>>>>> I studied the Charter document. From the problem statement, it seems
>>>> that the ultimate goal is to develop a comprehensive solution that can
>>>> eliminate printer drivers.
>>>>>>>> If my understanding is correct, I feel the "goal of IPP Everywhere"
>>>> paragraph is not emphasizing the objective of "eliminating printer
>>>> drivers" enough.
>>>>>> Fair enough, and good feedback that can be applied to the final version
>> of the charter.
>>>>>>> Also I feel setting an objective of " Use IPP/2.0 conformance level as
>>>> basis of IPP Everywhere." is too strict. No use case has been developed
>>>> for IPP Everywhere, it might be a bit earlier to decide on the
>> technical
>>>> details.
>>>>>> Given that this will be a project for the IPP working group and that
>> IPP/2.0 is the current version of IPP approved by the PWG, I don't think
>> it is a stretch to make IPP/2.0 the basis of "IPP Everywhere".
>>>>>> That said, there have also been discussions of mapping any new stuff we
>> come up with to the PWG semantic model, which will allow it to be used
>> with other protocol bindings as well.
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for your attention.
>>>> George
>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Michael Sweet [mailto:msweet at apple.com]
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2010 3:46 PM
>>>> To: George Liu
>>>> Cc: William Wagner; ipp at pwg.org>>>> Subject: Re: [IPP] Stable draft of IPP Everywhere Project Charter (17
>>>> April2010)
>>>>>>>> On Apr 27, 2010, at 3:33 PM, George Liu wrote:
>>>>>> IPP Everywhere (wd-ippeve10-yyyymmdd) - defines ... one IPP
>>>> Everywhere
>>>>> conformance level, based on the IPP/2.0 conformance level defined in
>>>> PWG
>>>>> IPP Version 2.0 Second Edition
>>>>>>>>>> Does it mean a IPP Everywhere complaint software/printer has to be IPP
>>>>> 2.0 or 2.1 or 2.2 compliant?
>>>>>>>> Since we haven't even started the charter vote for IPP Everywhere yet
>>>> (hoping to get that out today, we'll see...) it is impossible to answer
>>>> that authoritatively, however I have always pitched IPP Everywhere as
>>>> IPP/2.0+ (that is, 2.0 or higher).
>>>>>>>>>> STD-2 Prototype working draft of IPP Everywhere - Q2 2011
>>>>> Has any company committed to the development of IPP Everywhere
>>>>> prototype?
>>>>>>>> See above. I have received positive feedback from several vendors
>>>> already, so I think it is a safe bet that we'll have at least a few
>>>> prototypes to play with. Also, CUPS already implements everything that
>>>> has been discussed for IPP Everywhere thus far...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>> George
>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: ipp-bounces at pwg.org [mailto:ipp-bounces at pwg.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>> Michael Sweet
>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 23, 2010 11:26 AM
>>>>> To: William Wagner
>>>>> Cc: ipp at pwg.org>>>>> Subject: Re: [IPP] Stable draft of IPP Everywhere Project Charter (17
>>>>> April2010)
>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2010, at 10:55 AM, William Wagner wrote:
>>>>>> Sorry I missed the IPP call and did not bring this up at the Steering
>>>>>> committee call. What is the status of this charter? Is it going to be
>>>>> put up
>>>>>> for PWG vote?
>>>>>>>>>> Yes, Ira posted a "final draft" and I am in the process of getting
>>>> that
>>>>> email out... If not today, Monday...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>>>> Bill Wagner
>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: ipp-bounces at pwg.org [mailto:ipp-bounces at pwg.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>> Ira
>>>>>> McDonald
>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2010 1:37 PM
>>>>>> To: ipp at pwg.org; Michael R Sweet; Ira McDonald
>>>>>> Subject: [IPP] Stable draft of IPP Everywhere Project Charter (17
>>>>> April
>>>>>> 2010)
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>>>>>> [For discussion during IPP WG meeting on Monday 19 April]
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In preparation for PWG Formal Vote, I have just posted a Stable draft
>>>>> of the
>>>>>> IPP Everywhere Project Charter (4th version) at:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippeverywhere-charter-20100417.pdf>>>>> /
>>>>>> doc
>>>>>> - clean copy with line numbers
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippeverywhere-charter-20100417->> rev.p
>>>>> df
>>>>>> /doc
>>>>>> - redline copy with line numbers
>>>>>>>>>>>> Only changes are status to Stable and corrected several typos.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> - Ira (IPP co-editor)
>>>>>>>>>>>> Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)
>>>>>> Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG
>>>>>> Co-Chair - TCG Hardcopy WG
>>>>>> IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB
>>>>>> Blue Roof Music/High North Inc
>>>>>>http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic>>>>>>http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc>>>>>> mailto:blueroofmusic at gmail.com>>>>>> winter:
>>>>>> 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176
>>>>>> 734-944-0094
>>>>>> summer:
>>>>>> PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839
>>>>>> 906-494-2434
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
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>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> ipp mailing list
>>>>>>ipp at pwg.org>>>>>>https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________________________________________
>>>>> Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
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>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> ipp mailing list
>>>>>ipp at pwg.org>>>>>https://www.pwg.org/mailman/listinfo/ipp>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________________________________________
>>>> Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ________________________________________________________________________
>>> Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
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________________________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair
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