P1394 Mail Archive: P1394> RE: [PP1394:00042] PWG Network sub-group minutes

P1394 Mail Archive: P1394> RE: [PP1394:00042] PWG Network sub-group minutes

P1394> RE: [PP1394:00042] PWG Network sub-group minutes

Fumio Nagasaka (fumiona@venus.dtinet.or.jp)
Sun, 22 Jun 1997 04:48:59 +0900

Alan Berkema wrote:
* Shimura san of Cannon asked a question about the 1284.4 over SBP-2
* presentation.
* He wanted to know if bi-directional communication could be
* accomplished with the initiator performing 2 logins, one for each
* direction. This is an alternative to the idea presented where the
* Initiator logs into the Target for outbound communication and the
* Target logs into the Initiator for inbound communication.
* This idea requires further investigation and discussion

Actually we don't need to operate 2 logins for bi-directional communication.
SBP-2 is designed to cover HDD, so we can operate read/write within
single login. If we use function code = 4 in Management ORB, it does means
we can do any command set dependent operation. Thus our target device
may return an address offset for reverse channel output buffer, according to
the specification. I guess 2 logins for bi-directional communications bring
us difficulties to design 1284.4 over SBP-2.

-------------------------------
Fumio Nagasaka
Epson Software Development Laboratory Inc.
Tel +81 268 25 4111, Fax +81 268 25 4627
E-mail to genesis@hd.epson.co.jp

-----Original Message-----
From: ALAN_BERKEMA@hp-roseville-om2.om.hp.com [SMTP:ALAN_BERKEMA@hp-roseville-om2.om.hp.com]
Sent: Saturday, June 21, 1997 5:46 AM
To: pp1394 ML
Subject: [PP1394:00042] PWG Network sub-group minutes

Item Subject: cc:Mail Text
12 June 1997

Minutes for the ad-hoc 1394 Network PWG meeting.

Agenda:
- What do we mean by networking over 1394?
- Status of IP1394
- 1284.4 over SBP-2
- Issues

- What do we mean by networking over 1394?
--------------------------------------------------------

This question deserves considerable thought and we welcome additional opinions.
The following is only my opinion.

Networking over 1394 probably refers to the IP1394 effort. Once IP is truly
encapsulated in 1394 packets, Networking over 1394 in the Local Area should work
very similar to how it works over Ethernet today. Networking in a Wide Area
would require 1394 to network routers.

In small work groups 1284.4 over SBP could be viewed as a network, since devices
could have multiple connections.

- Status of IP1394

IP over 1394 started with work by DAVIC. DAVIC decided to pass the IP over 1394
standards work to the IETF. The IETF held a Birds Of a Feather meeting at the
IETF quarterly meeting in April 1997. The IETF decided three was sufficient
interest to form a working group with Myron Hattig of Intel as one of the
co-chairs. IP1394 is still waiting to be approved as an official working group.

To subscribe to the IP1394 reflector send e-mail to:
listserv@mailbag.intel.com
no subject, a one line message of "subscribe ip1394".
There are currently 3 proposals.

The DAVIC proposal, the Microsoft proposal and a proposal by Peter Johansson.

The pre-approved charter of the IETF IP1394 working is provided below.

==========================================================================
IP1394 WORKING GROUP CHARTER

The goal of the IP1394 Working Group is to define IP networking
over
1394 Serial Bus. 1394 Serial Bus (1394) is specified by IEEE Std
1394-1995 and the draft standard IEEE P1394a. The IP1394 working
group
will define facilities for the 1394 asynchronous and isochronous
transmission of unicast, broadcast and multicast IP packets.

The IP1394 working group is utilizing 1394 facilities to provide
the
functions similar to other data link networks residing between IP
and
physical layer protocols. Unlike most other data link networks,
1394
is capable of both asynchronous and isochronous transmission.
These
capabilities have a significant impact on the usage of IP over
1394.
The IP1394 working group will prepare an architecture document
and
appropriate protocol documents for the usage of these unique link
layer properties. Both IPv4 and IPv6 will be addressed, although
in
separate documents.

The IP1394 working group intends for the specification to be
utilized
by devices with a broad range of capabilities. The devices are
not
limited to but are expected to include both traditional equipment
such
as computers, as well as equipment that has not been
traditionally
networked such as consumer electronics (e.g. TVs & VCRs).

The IP1394 working group will maintain informal liaison with
other
standards groups and industry organizations. Liaison will be
accomplished by the circulation of drafts and the submission of
brief
reports to the other groups.

The IP1394 working group is chartered to deliver the documents
described below. Some of these documents may depend upon
facilities not
currently standardized in 1394. If the working group considers it
advisable to request modification or extension of existing IEEE
standards or IEEE standards in development, it will make
recommendation(s) to the relevant IEEE working group. The IP1394
working group will not request documents that depend upon such
changes
to be advanced to standards track RFCs until the changes have
been
endorsed by the relevant IEEE working group(s).

The deliverable documents are as follows:

- A document listing two groups. IEEE groups for which the IP1394
working group may need approval. Groups that benefit from
informal
liaisons. These lists are to be reviewed at regular intervals.

- An architecture document detailing the interactions between
1394
asynchronous and isochronous transmissions, resource reservation
and
multicast.

- An IPv4 over 1394 document covering the encapsulation and
framing of
IPv4 unicast, multicast and broadcast packets over asynchronous
and
isochronous 1394, including address resolution.

- An IPv6 over 1394 document covering the encapsulation and
framing of
IPv6 unicast, multicast and broadcast packets over asynchronous
and
isochronous 1394, including neighbor discovery.

- A media-specific MIB for managing 1394 interfaces.

Goals and Milestones:

May 97
Create list of liaisons and dependent IEEE 1394 working groups.
Meet to discuss pros/cons of proposals for Internet-Draft on IPv4
over
1394 & interaction architecture.

Jun 97
Meet to reduce number of proposals based on pros/cons presented
for
Internet-Draft on IPv4 over 1394 & interaction architecture.

July 97
Meet to reduce number of proposals Internet-Draft on IPv4 over
1394 &
interaction architecture.

Aug 97
Update list of liaisons and dependent IEEE 1394 working groups.
Post Internet-Draft listing all remaining proposals on IPv4 over
1394
& interaction architecture.
Meet at IETF to discuss two drafts.

Sep 97
Update final list of liaisons and dependent IEEE 1394 working
groups
for IPv4 & Interaction Arch last call documents.
Meet to finalize Internet-Draft on IPv4 over 1394 & interaction
architecture.
Post Internet-Draft on IPv4 over 1394 & interaction architecture
for
last call.
Create schedule for discussing 1394 MIB and IPv6. Target dates
are
June 98 for last call, Dec 98 for submission to Standards Track
RFC.

Dec 97
Meet to record implementation experiences with Internet-Draft on
IPv4
& interaction architecture.
Discuss IPv6 and MIB.

April 98
Meet to incorporate feed back from implementations into IPv4 and
interaction architecture drafts.
Get official feedback from appropriate IEEE 1394 working groups.
Submit IPv4 and Arch documents for Standards Track RFC.
Discuss IPv6 and MIB.

June 98
Post 1394 MIB and IPv6 doc for last call.

Dec 98
Post 1394 MIB and IPv6 doc for Standards Track RFC.

======================================================================
====

- 1284.4 over SBP-2
-------------------------

Shimura san of Cannon asked a question about the 1284.4 over SBP-2
presentation.
He wanted to know if bi-directional communication could be
accomplished with the initiator performing 2 logins, one for each
direction. This is an alternative to the idea presented where the
Initiator logs into the Target for outbound communication and the
Target logs into the Initiator for inbound communication.
This idea requires further investigation and discussion.


- Issues
--------

1284.4 over SBP-2 issues will be handled separately.

If the IETF is working on IP1394 is there any additional work required
by the PWG?

--------

Regards,

Alan Berkema
Direct Connect Operation
Hewlett Packard MS# 5558
8000 Foothills Blvd
Roseville Ca.
95747
alan_berkema@hp.com
916 785-5605
916 785-5959 (fax)