IPP Mail Archive: Fwd: RE: UPD> Re: IPP> MED - Media Stan

Fwd: RE: UPD> Re: IPP> MED - Media Standardized Names Draft D0.4 down- loaded

From: RonBergman@aol.com
Date: Thu Mar 29 2001 - 12:06:21 EST

  • Next message: RonBergman@aol.com: "Fwd: RE: UPD> Re: IPP> MED - Media Standardized Names Draft D0.4 down- loaded"

    attached mail follows:


    Tom,

    I agree that we should add the Media Finish to the document and I
    will include this in the next draft.

    I disagee with your proposal for adding printer size restrictions
    to the document. So far this specification has only involved
    attributes related to media. Now you are proposing that we add
    an attribute that is related to printers. This belongs in the
    appropriate UPnP or IPP or other document that defines how to
    describe a printer. If we add this then it will be necessary
    to include the concept of media input sub-units and then we will
    have to add the capacity limitations. And now we will need some
    way to identify the various input sub-units so we will have to
    define a naming mechanism. Oh, and there are also output sub-
    units that store media, so we will have to do the same for them.
    But media also depletes from input sub-units and can jam, so we
    need a way to define these conditions. And so on and so on.
    Before you know it we have replicated the entire Printer MIB!

        Ron

    -----Original Message-----
    From: Hastings, Tom N [mailto:hastings@cp10.es.xerox.com]
    Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2001 6:51 PM
    To: Bergman, Ron; 'Michael Sweet'
    Cc: ipp (E-mail); UPDF WG (E-mail); 'RonBergman@aol.com'; Norbert Schade
    (E-mail)
    Subject: RE: UPD> Re: IPP> MED - Media Standardized Names Draft D0.4
    down- loaded

    In response to Michael's three suggestions:

    1. Request to add roll media as a media type. I agree with Ron's answer.
    The current definition of the 'continuous' types indicates that it consists
    of sheets (of a predetermined size) connected together, while roll media
    requires cutting. Here are the definitions from the Media standard:

    continuous Continuously connected sheets of an opaque material - which
    edge is connected is not specified
    continuous-long Continuously connected sheets of an opaque material
    connected along the long edge
    continuous-short Continuously connected sheets of an opaque material
    connected along the short edge

    So I think we should not introduce the notion of roll media and stick with
    roll media being out of scope.

    2. Request to add media finish, here is what the PWG IEEE-ISTO Production
    Printing standard, 5100.3 has for "media-front-coating" and
    "media-back-coating" (not media finish, but I think they are the same
    thing):

    3.13.10 media-front-coating (type3 keyword | name(MAX)) and
    media-back-coating (type3 keyword | name(MAX))

    The "media-front-coating" and "media-back-coating" member attributes
    indicate what pre-process coating has been applied to the front and back of
    the desired media, respectively.

    Standard keyword values for "media-front-coating" and "media-back-coating"
    are:

    'none' Indicated that the media MUST not have any coating.
    'glossy' Indicates that the media MUST have a "glossy" coating.
    'high-gloss' Indicates that the media MUST have a "high-gloss" coating.
    'semi-gloss' Indicates that the media MUST have a "semi-gloss" coating.
    'satin' Indicates that the media MUST have a "satin" coating.
    'matte' Indicates that the media MUST have a "matte" coating.

    The "media-front-coating-supported" (1setOf (type3 keyword | name(MAX))) and
    "media-back-coating-supported" (1setOf (type3 keyword | name(MAX))) Printer
    attribute identifies the values of these "media-front-coating" and
    "media-back-coating" member attributes that the Printer supports.

    JDF Spirial 6 also includes the same values and as "coatings", not "finish":

    FrontCoatings ? Enumeration-Span What pre-process coating has been applied
    to the front
    surface of the media. Possible values are:
    None: the default.
    Glossy
    HighGloss
    Matte
    Satin
    Semigloss

    So I would not oppose adding MediaCoating to the Media standard, what do
    others think?

    3. Request to represent minimum and maximum size for use with the custom
    mechanism. Interestingly, UPnP Print template has a way to represent the
    minimum and maximum sizes that a Printer supports using the custom syntax.
    Translating the UPnP syntax to our ABNF would become:

       custom-media-size-max-self-describing-name =
             [prefix] "custom-max" "." short-dim "-" long-dim

       custom-media-size-min-self-describing-name =
             [prefix] "custom-min" "." short-dim "-" long-dim

    Such an addition would be necessary, if the UPnP Printer template is to
    reference our PWG standard for its MediaType and MediaSize syntaxes and
    standardized values, instead of defining its own syntax.

    So I'd be in favor of adding the minimum and maximum syntax for use with
    custom media sizes.

    Tom

    -----Original Message-----
    From: Bergman, Ron [mailto:Ron.Bergman@Hitachi-hkis.com]
    Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2001 08:36
    To: 'Michael Sweet'; Hastings, Tom N
    Cc: ipp (E-mail); UPDF WG (E-mail); 'RonBergman@aol.com'; Norbert Schade
    (E-mail)
    Subject: RE: UPD> Re: IPP> MED - Media Standardized Names Draft D0.4
    down- loaded

    Michael,

    In response to your comments:

    1. Roll paper was purposely omitted from the document. Refer to
    the second paragraph of section 1.1, Scope. This decision was
    made for two reasons; 1) it adds another level of complexity to
    the document and 2) there appears to be very little interest by
    PWG participants in roll feed devices.

    2. Since we have already "bit the bullet" and added Media Type
    and Color, finish is a likely next step. Since my time is
    currently limited and knowledge of this subject is minimal,
    a volunteer is needed to provide the necessary input. So,
    when can you have a draft? ;-)

    3. Maximum and minimum values define a characteristic of the
    printer and I believe this is way beyond the scope of this
    document. The Printer MIB currently provides an excellent
    source for this information.

        Ron Bergman
        Hitachi Koki Imaging Solutions

    -----Original Message-----
    From: Michael Sweet [mailto:mike@easysw.com]
    Sent: Friday, March 23, 2001 5:49 AM
    To: Hastings, Tom N
    Cc: ipp (E-mail); UPDF WG (E-mail)
    Subject: UPD> Re: IPP> MED - Media Standardized Names Draft D0.4
    down-loaded

    "Hastings, Tom N" wrote:
    >
    > So Ron and I have agreed to add the Media Type Names to the Media
    > Size Name standard, if that was the consensus at the meeting. We
    > need to work on the conformance language some more.
    > ...

    OK, some general comments:

        1. For the media type names, is "continuous" considered to be
           the same as "roll"? I ask only because roll paper does not
           have the perforations that continuous forms have.

           I suggest adding a "roll" media type or ammending the
           description for "continuous" to include roll type media
           with no perforations.

        2. The current media types don't address variations of particular
           media types; these variations are generally the "finish" of
           the media (glossy, matte, etc.), so I would recommend adding
           standard "media finish" values that can be used to identify
           an exact media type, rather than overloading the current
           media types with additional name-finish varients.

        3. There is presently no way to define the min & max custom
           media size; this is absolutely required for this to work
           in the real world (otherwise how do you know what media
           sizes are valid?), e.g.:

               "custom-size-minimum." short-dim "-" long-dim
               "custom-size-maximum." short-dim "-" long-dim

           This would essentially research the "size-minimum" and
           "size-maximum" names, but allow a device to communicate
           that any size from the minimum to the maximum dimensions
           is supported. If these sizes are not available then the
           client should only select media sizes from the provided
           list.

    -- 
    ______________________________________________________________________
    Michael Sweet, Easy Software Products                  mike@easysw.com
    Printing Software for UNIX                       http://www.easysw.com
    



    This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Thu Mar 29 2001 - 12:12:21 EST