IPP Mail Archive: RE: IPP> Re: SM> JobX Telecon *NEW NUMB

IPP Mail Archive: RE: IPP> Re: SM> JobX Telecon *NEW NUMB

RE: IPP> Re: SM> JobX Telecon *NEW NUMBER & PASSCODE*

From: McDonald, Ira (imcdonald@sharplabs.com)
Date: Mon Jun 16 2003 - 13:05:36 EDT

  • Next message: Hastings, Tom N: "IPP> Re: Dennis's ISSUE about Job and Printer Description names being the same"

    Hi Dennis,

    A more faithful suffix (than "docdefault" or "default")
    might be "requested" (which currently means "client
    requested" as opposed to "administrator configured"
    for "default").

    I agree that the flat namespace in "notify-attributes"
    (any Subscription, Printer, or Job, attribute name) is
    a problem that gets worse over time (as we define new
    IPP attributes and extensions).

    Cheers,
    - Ira McDonald
      High North Inc

    -----Original Message-----
    From: Dennis Carney [mailto:dcarney@us.ibm.com]
    Sent: Monday, June 16, 2003 10:46 AM
    To: ipp@pwg.org
    Subject: IPP> Re: SM> JobX Telecon *NEW NUMBER & PASSCODE*

    All,

    If I'm not mistaken, in the teleconference yesterday, we pretty much
    accepted Pete's proposal below without change.

    However, I realized something: the "xxx-default" names that we have
    assigned at the Job level (e.g. document-format-default) are the first case
    where a Job level attribute has the same name as a Printer level attribute.
    This would not be a problem except that we discovered the other day that
    IPP notifications have a flat name space of attributes that the client
    requests and that the Printer responds with. This is fine as long as there
    are no Printer attributes that have the same name as Job attributes. We
    are breaking that now: if the client requests the
    "document-charset-default" attribute, for example, the Printer doesn't know
    whether to return the Printer level "document-charset-default" or the Job
    level one, and the client that receives the notification doesn't know which
    is which either.

    Do we need to rethink our decision?

    An idea that I had that I never brought up because I was persuaded by the
    other participants was to create a new suffix for this type of attribute.
    For example, "-docdefault", rather than "-default". I thought this might
    not be a bad idea due to the fact that we were introducing a new concept.

    Dennis Carney
    IBM Printing Systems

     

                          "Zehler, Peter"

                          <PZehler@crt.xero To: "IPP Discussion
    List (E-mail)" <IPP@pwg.org>
                          x.com> cc: "PWG Semantic Model
    WG (E-mail)" <sm@pwg.org>
                          Sent by: Subject: SM> JobX Telecon
    *NEW NUMBER & PASSCODE*
                          owner-sm@pwg.org

     

     

                          06/09/03 01:17 PM

     

     

    All,

    This Thursday at 1pm EDT is the Semantic Model teleconference. This week's
    teleconference will be dedicated to IPP Jobx. I will post the document
    later today. This review will prepare the document for the Face-to-Face.

    The teleconference is 2 hours long. It will be run using phone and Webex.
    Anyone that does not yet have Webex installed should do that before
    Thursday. Information for the phone and Webex are included below. NOTE:
    New Dial in number and passcode

    The agenda for the Semantic Model teleconference is :
    1) Discuss the remaining issue and reach consensus

    The following issue came up during the Review of the JOBX specification on
    June 4, which affects the Job Extension spec, the Document Object spec, and
    the PWG Semantic Model spec.

    For IPP there are the following Operation attributes that a client MAY
    supply in a Print-Job or Print-URI operation for specifying Document
    Attributes that do not have corresponding Description attributes defined
    until the Document Object specification:

    compression (type2 (keyword))
    document-charset (charset)
    document-digital-signature (type2 (keyword))
    document-format (mimeMediaType)
    document-format-details (1setOf (collection))
    document-format-version (text(127))
    document-message (text(MAX))
    document-name (name(MAX))
    document-natural-language (naturalLanguage)

    The preceding attributes are attributes of a Document. Therefore, unless
    the Document object is implemented, it is not possible for a client to
    completely determine what a client had submitted. As a consequence, it is
    also not possible for an application to completely archive a single
    document
    job using the Get-Job-Attributes operation. Furthermore FSG is using these
    attributes at the Job level in its APIs. When implementing the Document
    object, these same attributes can be supplied in the Send-Document and
    Send-URI operation as well. These attribute have slightly different
    semantics at the Job level than they do at the Document level.

    A solution for IPP JOBX (whether or not implementing the Document object)
    would be to define corresponding Job Description attributes for these
    specific operation attributes with the semantics that they are the defaults
    for the all the Document objects in the Job (even single document jobs
    created with Print-Job and Print-URI). These new Job Description
    attributes
    would be :
    compression-default (type2 (keyword))
    document-charset-default (charset)
    document-digital-signature-default (type2 (keyword))
    document-format-default (mimeMediaType)
    document-format-details-default (1setOf (collection))
    document-format-version-default (text(127))
    document-message-default (text(MAX))
    document-name-default (name(MAX))
    document-natural-language-default (naturalLanguage)
    These new attributes would be populated by the associated operational
    attribute if supplied.

    The file for telecon is the pdf file:
    ftp://www.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/new_JOBX/wd-ippjobx10-20030609.pdf
    NOTE: This file does not include the above proposal for the remaining
    issue.
    However, given the time and my schedule I wanted to get something out. If
    possible I will get an update out later this week. The main issue and
    resolution proposal is explained fairly well above.

    Pete

    ________________________________________________

    Dial in Info:
    Phone Number:(877) 707-6056
    (Phone Number for Xerox Employees: 8*594-0077)
     PARTICIPANT PASSCODE: 437874#
    ________________________________________________
    webex info:
    We will also use an on line tool called webex,
    if you have not used this before, setup up by
    following the First Time Users instructions.
    Do this in advance of the meeting.

    -------------------------
    FIRST TIME USERS
    -------------------------
    For fully interactive meetings, including the ability
    to present your documents and applications, a one-time
    setup takes less than 10 minutes. Click this URL to set up now:

    http://hp.webex.com

    Then click New User.
    -------------------------

    On Thursday use:
    https://hp.webex.com/join/

    Then click join unlisted meeting.
    Use the info below:
    -------------------------

    Webex MEETING SUMMARY
    -------------------------
    Topic: PWG Semantic Model
    Date: Thursday, June 12, 2003
    Time: 10:00 am, Pacific Daylight Time (GMT -07:00, San Jose)
    Meeting number: 21366675
    Meeting password: pwg_sm1!
    Host:
    Bob Taylor (HP)

    ___________________________________________________

                                                     Peter Zehler
                                                     XEROX
                                                     Xerox Innovation Group
                                                     Email:
    PZehler@crt.xerox.com
                                                     Voice: (585) 265-8755
                                                     FAX: (585) 422-7961
                                                     US Mail: Peter Zehler
                                                             Xerox Corp.
                                                             800 Phillips Rd.
                                                             M/S 128-25E
                                                             Webster NY,
    14580-9701



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