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Hi,<br><br>I second all of Mike's comments.<br><br>I'd rather have no definition at all than have one that is obscure or has<br>too much latitude in interpretation.<br><br>Cheers,<br>- Ira<br><br clear="all"><div><div class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr">Ira McDonald (Musician / Software Architect)<br>Co-Chair - TCG Trusted Mobility Solutions WG<br>Chair - Linux Foundation Open Printing WG<br>Secretary - IEEE-ISTO Printer Working Group<br>Co-Chair - IEEE-ISTO PWG Internet Printing Protocol WG<br>IETF Designated Expert - IPP & Printer MIB<br>Blue Roof Music / High North Inc<br><a style="color:rgb(51,51,255)" href="http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic" target="_blank">http://sites.google.com/site/blueroofmusic</a><br><a style="color:rgb(102,0,204)" href="http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc" target="_blank">http://sites.google.com/site/highnorthinc</a><br>mailto: <a href="mailto:blueroofmusic@gmail.com" target="_blank">blueroofmusic@gmail.com</a><br>Winter 579 Park Place Saline, MI 48176 734-944-0094<br>Summer PO Box 221 Grand Marais, MI 49839 906-494-2434<br><br><div style="display:inline"></div><div style="display:inline"></div><div style="display:inline"></div><div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div></div></div></div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 5:21 PM, Michael Sweet <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:msweet@apple.com" target="_blank">msweet@apple.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word">Bill,<div><br></div><div>Comments inline...</div><div><br></div><div><div>
<div><span style="font-family:'Andale Mono'">_________________________________________________________</span><br style="font-family:'Andale Mono'"><span style="font-family:'Andale Mono'">Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair</span></div>
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<br><div><blockquote type="cite"><div>On Jul 13, 2015, at 12:47 PM, <a href="mailto:wamwagner@comcast.net" target="_blank">wamwagner@comcast.net</a> wrote:</div><div><div dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><div><p style="margin:0in 0in 10pt"><font>...</font></p></div></div></div></blockquote><span class=""><blockquote type="cite"><div><div dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><div><p style="margin:0in 0in 10pt"><font style="font-family:Calibri,'Segoe UI',Meiryo,'Microsoft YaHei UI','Microsoft JhengHei UI','Malgun Gothic',sans-serif;font-size:12pt" face="Arial">I am unhappy with "...<span> </span><span>conformance requirement that applies to a particular capability or feature</span>." as a general statement because:</font></p><font face="Calibri, Segoe UI, Meiryo, Microsoft YaHei UI, Microsoft JhengHei UI, Malgun Gothic, sans-serif" size="3"></font><p style="font-family:Calibri,'Segoe UI',Meiryo,'Microsoft YaHei UI','Microsoft JhengHei UI','Malgun Gothic',sans-serif;font-size:12pt;margin:0in 0in 10pt 0.5in"><font face="Arial"><span> <span> </span></span>a. Most conformance requirements apply to a particular capability or feature. I assume that one is to infer that the requirement applies only if that capability or feature exists in the subject implementation seeking to be conformant.</font></p></div></div></div></blockquote></span>Per RFC 2119, REQUIRED, MUST, and MUST NOT are unconditional by themselves. You make them conditional by making the statement containing them conditional, e.g., 'If the Printer supports two-sided printing, the Printer MUST support the "sides" Job Template attribute.'</div><div><br></div><div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><div><font face="Calibri, Segoe UI, Meiryo, Microsoft YaHei UI, Microsoft JhengHei UI, Malgun Gothic, sans-serif" size="3"></font><p style="font-family:Calibri,'Segoe UI',Meiryo,'Microsoft YaHei UI','Microsoft JhengHei UI','Malgun Gothic',sans-serif;font-size:12pt;margin:0in 0in 10pt 0.5in"><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Arial">...</span></p></div></div></blockquote><span class=""><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><div><p style="font-family:Calibri,'Segoe UI',Meiryo,'Microsoft YaHei UI','Microsoft JhengHei UI','Malgun Gothic',sans-serif;font-size:12pt;margin:0in 0in 10pt 0.5in"><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Arial">There is there is the additional question as to whether the term should 'Conditionally Required" or "Conditionally Mandatory". Since the basic compliance term is "Required", "Conditionally Required" seems more appropriate.</span></p></div></div></blockquote></span>Agreed.</div><div><span class=""><br><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><div><font face="Calibri, Segoe UI, Meiryo, Microsoft YaHei UI, Microsoft JhengHei UI, Malgun Gothic, sans-serif" size="3"></font><p style="font-family:Calibri,'Segoe UI',Meiryo,'Microsoft YaHei UI','Microsoft JhengHei UI','Malgun Gothic',sans-serif;font-size:12pt;margin:0in 0in 10pt"><font face="Arial">A reasonable variation on the 2003 definition and the RFC2119 definition of requirement levels is :</font></p><font face="Calibri, Segoe UI, Meiryo, Microsoft YaHei UI, Microsoft JhengHei UI, Malgun Gothic, sans-serif" size="3"></font><p style="font-family:Calibri,'Segoe UI',Meiryo,'Microsoft YaHei UI','Microsoft JhengHei UI','Malgun Gothic',sans-serif;font-size:12pt;margin:0in 0in 10pt 0.5in"><font face="Arial"><i>CONDITIONALLY REQUIRED</i>: definition is a requirement of the specification if the specified condition is true.</font></p></div></div></blockquote></span><div>I'm not super happy with this...</div><span class=""><br><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><div><font face="Calibri, Segoe UI, Meiryo, Microsoft YaHei UI, Microsoft JhengHei UI, Malgun Gothic, sans-serif" size="3"></font><p style="font-family:Calibri,'Segoe UI',Meiryo,'Microsoft YaHei UI','Microsoft JhengHei UI','Malgun Gothic',sans-serif;font-size:12pt;margin:0in 0in 10pt"><font face="Arial">One might prefer a term other than "definition", such as capability or feature, and consider a requirement of the implementation rather than of the specification, but RFC 2119 wording<span> </span><span> </span>is:" <span>… </span>definition is an absolute requirement of the specification."</font></p><font face="Calibri, Segoe UI, Meiryo, Microsoft YaHei UI, Microsoft JhengHei UI, Malgun Gothic, sans-serif" size="3"></font><p style="font-family:Calibri,'Segoe UI',Meiryo,'Microsoft YaHei UI','Microsoft JhengHei UI','Malgun Gothic',sans-serif;font-size:12pt;margin:0in 0in 10pt"><font face="Arial">Alternatively, we could modify the current definition to:</font></p><font face="Calibri, Segoe UI, Meiryo, Microsoft YaHei UI, Microsoft JhengHei UI, Malgun Gothic, sans-serif" size="3"></font><p style="font-family:Calibri,'Segoe UI',Meiryo,'Microsoft YaHei UI','Microsoft JhengHei UI','Malgun Gothic',sans-serif;font-size:12pt;margin:0in 0in 10pt 0.5in"><font face="Arial"><i>CONDITIONALLY REQUIRED</i>: A conformance requirement that applies if the specified condition is true.</font></p></div></div></blockquote></span><div>I like this better, or the definition you quoted from 5100.6:</div><div><br></div></div></div><span class=""><blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 40px;border:none;padding:0px"><div><div><div>"The term CONDITIONALLY REQUIRED means that the Printer MUST support the feature, if the specified condition is true."</div></div></div></blockquote><div><div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div></div></span></div><br>_______________________________________________<br>
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