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<div dir="ltr"><div><div><div><div>Hi,<br><br></div>Forwarding the conclusions from a recent off-list thread on IPP Staple<br></div>and Punch origins/angles/dimensions/etc.<br><br></div>Cheers,<br></div>- Ira<br><div><div><div><div><div><div><div class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><br><div style="display:inline"></div><div style="display:inline"></div><div style="display:inline"></div><div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div></div></div></div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: <b class="gmail_sendername">Michael Sweet</b> <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:msweet@apple.com">msweet@apple.com</a>></span><br>Date: Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 1:34 PM<br>Subject: Re: IPP definitions of staple and punch dimensions?<br>To: "Kennedy, Smith" <<a href="mailto:smith.kennedy@hp.com">smith.kennedy@hp.com</a>><br>Cc: Ira McDonald <<a href="mailto:blueroofmusic@gmail.com">blueroofmusic@gmail.com</a>><br><br><br><div style="word-wrap:break-word">Smith,<div><br><div><span class=""><blockquote type="cite"><div>On Nov 9, 2015, at 1:09 PM, Kennedy, Smith <<a href="mailto:smith.kennedy@hp.com" target="_blank">smith.kennedy@hp.com</a>> wrote:</div><br><div><div style="word-wrap:break-word">Even if we had "-supported" and "-default" I cannot imagine that a) the attributes would be commonly used (likely would be hidden under an "advanced" section in UI); and b) would usually be a very small set unless the device is very capable.</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div></span><div>Agreed. (that's why I suggested possible xxx-configured attributes to provide implementation details to the client, no xxx-supported or xxx-default)</div><span class=""><br><blockquote type="cite"><div><div style="word-wrap:break-word">I want to document the current "design pattern" for attribute clusters, because the shift from "xxx-default" / "xxx-supported" to "xxx-default" / "xxx-configured" / "xxx-supported" is still a shift for me.</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div></span>An errata that defines the intent would be OK by me.</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div><div style="word-wrap:break-word"><span class=""><div><br></div><div>A couple of follow-up questions from our firmware folks:</div><div><br></div></span><div><blockquote type="cite"><div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-US"><div><span class=""><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Given a top staple left of a portrait document, I can construct the following diagram:<u></u><u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></div></span><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span><image002.png></span></div></div></div></blockquote><span class=""><blockquote type="cite"><div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-US"><div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">This is the top left of a page.<u></u><u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><span>·<span style="font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times New Roman'"> </span></span></span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Center of staple is the intersection of line segment AB & GH.<u></u><u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><span>·<span style="font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times New Roman'"> </span></span></span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Does this make the stitching offset the distance from the left side of the document to the line segment GH?<u></u><u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><span>·<span style="font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times New Roman'"> </span></span></span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Is the Process Axis line segment GH<u></u><u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Or<u></u><u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><span>·<span style="font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times New Roman'"> </span></span></span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Is the Process Axis line segment CD<u></u><u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><span>·<span style="font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times New Roman'"> </span></span></span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Offset is the distance from line segment CD to edge of page<u></u><u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><span>·<span style="font-size:7pt;line-height:normal;font-family:'Times New Roman'"> </span></span></span><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Center is the projection of the staple’s physical center to the line segment CD.</span></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>IMHO, the first is the right one. Is there any concern with a portion of the staple being between the process axis and the edge? If that is an issue that must be accounted for, punched holes would violate that as well, much more egregiously than a staple that is parallel to the reference edge.</span></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>I agree that the first one is correct (or what I would expect, anyways... :)</div><div><br></div><div>As for the staple going over the edge, I'd guess the printer would limit the supported stitching-locations and stitching-offset values to prevent the staple from going off the edge.</div><div><br></div><div><span class=""><blockquote type="cite"><div><div style="word-wrap:break-word"><div>Also, the snippet of CIP4 JDF below doesn't seem to specify a staple rotation angle, which would be needed for making these calculations, unless we were to use one end of the staple as the axis (which would be another alternative for ensuring that none of the staple would intrude into the space between the reference edge and process axis).</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-US"><div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt"> </span></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Also why do the specs assume the staples are parallel to the reference edge, when in the case of single staples they are clearly angled?</span></div></div></div></blockquote></div><div><br></div><div><div>Isn't this an informal convention? I am pretty sure I've seen different implementations in the wild that place the corner staple parallel to either the left or top edges.</div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div></span>Yes, the angle is implementation-defined but currently undiscoverable by the Client to show the user...</div><div><br></div><div>(and FWIW most of the stapler finishers I've used have put the staples parallel to an edge and not angled...)</div><span class=""><div><br></div><div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word"><div><span style="font-family:'Andale Mono'">_________________________________________________________</span><br style="font-family:'Andale Mono'"><span style="font-family:'Andale Mono'">Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer</span></div></div>
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