Minutes: XHTML-Print working group meeting, November 5, 2002

Minutes: XHTML-Print working group meeting, November 5, 2002

Minutes of the November 5, 2002 meeting of the PWG XHTML-Print Committee

Jim Bigelow, 11/18/02


  1. Introductions
  2. Approval of the Agenda
  3. Review and Approve minutes from August Meeting ( http://www.pwg.org/xhtml-print/minutes/Minutes-August-2002.html)
  4. Review open issues and action items:
    1. Action Item open: Jacob Refstrup (HP) will locate and make available a version of a tool to find and mark differences between two html documents.
    2. Action Item open: Melinda Grant (now Jim Bigelow) asked how to keep the conformance section of the document (Section 2.3) in step with w3c specs. The discussion that followed weighted the value of a stable specification against the redundancy of restating other specifications. Therefore we should:
      1. Do more research on how the w3c documents handle this issue.
      2. Weight the pros and cons of two techniques:
        • Restate the conformance requirements in force at the time the spec is issued with changes and requirements necessary for XHTML-Print.
        • Simply refer to basic conformance requirements inherited from referenced documents and only state the exceptions, changes, and XHTML-Print requirements.
    3. Action Item open: Canon will bring up the issue of image rotation with the w3c so that a w3c approved method can created and used in the XHTML-Print specification. In the interim the processing of EXIF marker will be optional.
    4. Action Item open: Canon/HP -- The interaction with EXIF markers and a not yet developed CSS property for specifying the orientation/rotation of the images was discussed. What if the EXIF marker exists and the CSS property is or is not there? We should post the issue for discussion of the PWG XP mailing list for 2 weeks.
    5. Action Item open: Jim/Elliott: produce updated drafts with changes listed above, in time for a 1-month review before next meeting.
    6. Action Item open: Jim: Determine how to handle conformance statements with W3C documents.
    7. Action Item open: Jim: Follow up with Jacob on CSS rotation and running headers/footers.
  5. Other items
  6. Page by page review of XHTML-Print document http:/www.pwg.org/xhtml-print/HTML-Version/XHTML-Print.html
  7. Page by page review of CSS-Print document ( http://www.pwg.org/xhtml-print/HTML-Version/CSS-Print.html)
  8. Adjourn


• Peter Zehler, Xerox• Fumio Nagasaka, Epson• Geoff Soord, Software 2000
• Hitoshi Sekine, Ricoh• Jerry Thrasher, Lexmark• Atsushi Uchine, Epson
• Shunsaku Miyazawa, Epson• Cameron Brodeur, Ricoh• David Hall, HP
• Bob Taylor, HP• Junichi Ota. Ricoh• Rod Acosta, Agfa Monotype
• Lee Farrell, Canon• Alain Regnier, Ricoh• Yiruo Yang, Epson
• Athar Ahmad Minolta-QMS• Mabry Dozier, Minolta• Craig Whittle, Sharp
• Gail Songer, Peerless• Ted Tronson, Novell• Alan Berkema, HP
• Jim Bigelow, HP• Don Wright, Lexmark• Harry Lewis, IBM
• Bill Wagner

Approval of the Agenda

Approved without additions

Review and Approve minutes of August Meeting

Approved as recorded in http://www.pwg.org/xhtml-print/minutes/Minutes-August-2002.html.

Review open issues and action items

Item 1: html diff tool, owner Jacob Refstrup

Open: Don Wright will ask contacts about an html diff tool.

Item 2: XHTML-Print conformance statement format, owner Jim Bigelow

Closed: Jim Proposed modeling the conformance statement after the one in the XHTML Basic statement with a list of exceptions and additions. The statement to read:

A printer must conform to the "XHTML Family User Agent Conformance" section of the Modularization of XHTML specification (<[XHTMLMOD], section 3.5) with the following exceptions and additions:

  1. Validation is not required to claim conformance to this standard. A printer may "flush" or otherwise reject a non-conforming XHTML-Print document.
  2. Images:
    • If a printer encounters an image in a format it does not support, it shall render any alternate content provided, and may reserve the space specified by the height and width attributes by optionally drawing a box around this space of the size specified for the image.
    • If the image format is not supported or the height and width attributes are absent and no alternate content is provided, the image may be omitted and no space reserved.
    • If the image format is supported and the height and width attributes were omitted, the printer may choose to omit the image from the page.
  3. Printers may chose not to render content within elements defined by XHTML[XHTML1], or HTML[HTML4] that is obviously not intended to be rendered, e.g. <script>.
  4. A Form feed (&#000C;) must be treated as whitespace.
  5. Printers that do not support the xml:lang attribute are not required to adhere to the rules for language specific whitespace handling.

Item 3: Image Rotation Markup command by W3C , owner Cannon

Still open.

Item 4: Interaction of Image Orientation specification via EXIF markers and a CSS property, owner Cannon/HP

Still open.

Item 5: Create the next version of the specifications 1 month before November meeting, owner Jim Bigelow & Elliott Bradshaw

Closed: Drafts available the end of October. (http://www.pwg.org/hypermail/xp/0062.html).

Item 6: Determine how to handle conformance statements, owner Jim Bigelow

This is a restatement of item 2.

Item 7: Progress on CSS work on image rotation and running headers and footers, owner Jim Bigelow

Work within the W3S CSS working group on properties to specify an image's orientation, and to create running headers and footers on printed pages has not progressed to the pointer were there's a public draft. There may be one by early next year, but no time table has been set.

Other Items

1394 Trade Association's AV Working Group's usage of XHTML-Print - Fumio Nagasaka

Printing from a digital TV using XHTML-Print using additional CSS properties. The presentation: http://www.pwg.org/xhtml-print/minutes/XHTML-AVC.pdf

Action Item: Don Wright will make the full text of the proposal available and start discussions of extensions.

The proposed changes are available from: http://www.pwg.org/xhtml-print/minutes/CSSprintenhanced-XHTMLforDTVprint.pdf

Action Item: Jim Bigelow will make a version of the specification with a new Digital TV conformance level available before the next meeting in January.

Absolute Position - Don Wright

This central core of this issue is the memory and implementation requirements for implementing unrestricted positioning of elements anywhere on the page at any time during page rendering are prohibitive. The full issue is stated in http://www.pwg.org/hypermail/xp/0067.html.

Resolved: a printer may ignore elements that are positioned on portions of the page that have already been rendered. This caveat will be added to the conformance statement for discussion at subsequent meetings.

Comments from Elliott Bradshaw

These comments (http://www.pwg.org/hypermail/xp/0066.html) were discussed during the review of the documents.

Comments from Tom Hastings:

Comments: http://www.pwg.org/hypermail/xp/0070.html and http://www.pwg.org/hypermail/xp/0071.html

No discussion.

Comments from Jun Fugisawa:

http://www.pwg.org/hypermail/xp/0072.html, and http://www.pwg.org/hypermail/xp/0074.html were discussed during the review of the specifications.

http://www.pwg.org/hypermail/xp/0073.html was discussed. Most people would like to print a document that can be viewed in a browser. However, conformance to XHTML 1.0 may make this difficult.

Action Item: investigate what the Modularization of XHTML and XHTML 1.0 say about the treatment of non-well formed documents. No owner.

Page by page review of XHTML-Print:

The review notes are in the following link, section by section. Sections without comments are not shown. http://www.pwg.org/xhtml-print/HTML-Version/XHTML-PrintReview.htm

Page by page review of CSS Print Profile

The notes from the review of each section of the document are in the following link. Sections without comments are note shown. http://www.pwg.org/xhtml-print/HTML-Version/CSSPrintProfileReview.htm

Action Item: Jim Bigelow, Update specifications with comments from review and release on pwg page. Then create a new version of the specifications with information from the Digital TV enhancement requests. These will be discussed both on the xp mailing list of the pwg and at the next PWG XHTML-Print meeting January 20, 2003 in Maui,